Interview with ‘The Photography Show’ Podcast
I recently joined David McClelland on The Photography & Video Show Podcast for a conversation about my work, the people I’m drawn to photograph, and what keeps me excited about photography after more than a decade of doing it professionally.
We talked a lot about high performance — and why I’m fascinated by people who have dedicated huge parts of their lives to becoming exceptionally good at what they do. From principal ballerinas and elite athletes to surgeons and an 82-piece orchestra, we get into the access, trust and curiosity behind some of my favourite projects, and why I’m often more interested in what happens immediately before and after the performance than the performance itself.
I also break down the story behind my huge BBC Philharmonic group portrait, including how hearing the orchestra rehearse inspired the entire concept, why I always start with the creative before worrying about production, and how a risky experiment in the final ten minutes ended up producing the finished image.
Elsewhere, we talk about the realities of being a freelance photographer, how I use slightly unusual questions to relax people in front of the camera, and why buying my dream Hasselblad XPan II after a catastrophic breakup unexpectedly made me fall in love with photography all over again.
Topics covered:
Why I’m fascinated by high performers, expertise and sacrifice
Building trust and gaining access to normally unseen spaces
Photographing performers in the moments before and after they go on stage
How I direct and relax people who aren’t comfortable in front of a camera
The reality — and occasional loneliness — of working as a freelance photographer
Creating and photographing an 82-person portrait of the BBC Philharmonic
Why I start with ambitious creative ideas before solving the production
How personal projects have shaped my commercial career
Buying my Hasselblad XPan II and rediscovering photography through film
What I’m aiming for creatively and commercially in 2027
You can listen below, or scroll down for the full transcript!
Full Transcript
David McClelland
Commercial and advertising portrait photographer Drew Forsyth joins us to talk about his work chasing high performance and how a holy grail camera gave him a new lease of love for his craft. And we have some exciting updates to share ahead of the in-person photography and video show at the Excel in London next March, including a street full of newly confirmed brands and exhibitors, and first news of some exciting events and workshops taking place in London over the next few months. All of that in our "What 3 Things" feature coming up later on. Before we start, I want to say thank you all for listening to this new series of the podcast. But did you know that you can watch now too? We are video almost everywhere now on YouTube, as we have been for a while, but also now on Apple Podcasts and on Spotify. Look, it's exactly the same version of the show as the audio version, but for some extra visual treats, so in our chats with our professionals about their work, then do check out the accompanying video versions too.
Feature guest: Drew Forsyth.
David McClelland 21:34
Our feature guest today is Drew Forsyth, a Manchester-based portrait photographer with a rich body of work across commercial and advertising, arts and culture, and a penchant for pursuing high performance.
Drew Forsyth 21:48
I would describe my work primarily as working in the portrait space. So really I'm a portrait photographer, but within that, I'm shooting commercial advertising, it's that kind of thing. But really, when it comes to The work that I love to create, I'm really looking for what I would describe as a wow moment when you look at it and you go, Wow. Do you know what I mean? And that and that wow can come from anywhere, really. It can come from uh how did you get that location? Or oh my god, are you uh are you really with that person? Or how did you get up in that helicopter? Like it can that's really that's the thing I'm looking for. I you know, I really like making cinematic work and it's quite theatrical and uh yeah, it's that kind of thing.
David McClelland 22:34
Okay, so portraits primarily, whether that's for personal projects or commercial work. So portraits people predominantly, although, as you allude to there, there's some interesting, cinematic, thematic, dynamic contexts in which you find those people. And I've seen some of your work on location in New York, for example, with famous bridges behind you, or in studio as well, where you've got I th I think dancers contorted into these into these boxes. What is it about the the people, what is it about portrait work that particularly excites you?
Drew Forsyth 23:14
I think I'm really interested in expertise. Like I really love people who have dedicated their entire lives to their craft, so be it ballet or uh even you know, science or mathematicians or Nobel Prize winners, or people who are very, very good at what they do. That's what I'm really interested in. And people, especially people who've sacrificed something or they've had to give up everything else within their lives in order to pursue greatness, and you see that a lot with uh with footballers and athletes in particular. That they there is only that. Do you know what I mean? You can't really talk to them about anything else when you're on set. Um, so yeah, that's what I'm really drawn to. Um, and yeah, it's through that I've been very lucky to work with some amazing people, but yeah, dance obviously lends itself to that, but I wouldn't necessarily describe myself as a dance photographer. Like I'm really interested, I'm just interested in that their kind of strength and prowess and grace and and that, and yeah, and like giving up everything else to pursue it, often for a very short amount of time.
David McClelland 24:18
Yeah, uh, and and there is a strong lean, and it's something I I definitely want to talk to with your work to uh performance and performing arts. But coming onto that, onto that performance and and high performance and what it takes to be a high performer, um, we'll talk about some of your commercial work in a few minutes' time, but onto your onto your personal projects, there is one of your projects called Performer. And you've taken, and it's not just about performing arts, you've got uh a rally driver there, um, a principal ballerina, and a world-leading hip surgeon. And I want to come on to Max in a moment. Um, but you are working with people who are so focused, so much at at the top of their game there. Uh, and it seems to be a kind of before and after. How did that project come about? And uh I mean it's incredible the kind of access that you get. How have you been able to curate whose lives, whose expertise, whose performance you are following?
Drew Forsyth 25:19
So that project really came about where I was already working with Bethany, the ballerina, on a different project, and she said that she was going to be performing in Manchester, and would I like to come along? Nice. And uh, as I was photographing her, she said, you know, uh they don't really ever let anyone else do this. And I thought, oh, I like that, that's a nice feeling, that kind of exclusivity. And then I as I was shooting, I thought, if if they're not letting many people do this, if I didn't have this access, what would I want to see? And so I started photographing not just her, but the ballet shoes on the table and her at the side of the stage and looking out into the auditorium, all these little moments, and it's also wrapped up in uh giving her something. So, you know, often if there's no one there, there is no record of these moments for her. So it kind of started with that, and then I thought, you know, if a little girl sits in the front or front row of the auditorium, she might see this performance and it might change the entire course of her life. I wonder if there are other things and other professions that are like that. And so I asked around, I asked friends, and I was chatting in the pub with people, and they said, Oh, you know, you should get in touch with this person. He's a GT3 rally driver. And you think, okay, there's an there's so much preparation that goes into that, and then you are performing at a very high level for an hour and a half, two hours, just like the ballerina. I thought, oh wow, this is great. And then, you know, once you've got two, then you need you need more, right? So then I decided what who else performs at a very high level and their actions affect someone's life directly. And then obviously replacement or a hip surgeon would be interesting. And then it is as well, it's driven by me going, Oh, I wonder, I wonder what that's like. I bet that would be interesting.
David McClelland 27:10
No, so I mean, I I'm looking at that portfolio portfolio work on your website at the moment, and I like how you have displayed that we've got the kind of verticals of Kelvin, isn't it? Kelvin Fletcher, who's the uh GT3 racing driver, the ballerina, and then Professor Max Feely on the right hand side. And you speak about the curiosity that that you had, which in a way kind of drew you into working with these people. As you scroll down this page, you've got the before, you've got the preparation. Then there is this little kind of beat on the page of something, the during, if you like, and there's a gap there. And then the final six images are the after. And really that obviously it completes the story, but you see everything that's gone into a performance, however you define performance, but then you see the I'm guessing exhaustion. Uh I'm guessing the impact of that performance. And in the case of uh Professor Max Feely, the uh hip surgeon, uh um you're seeing a bit of blood uh spattered over his face as well. Um just just talk to me about that after moment. The the preparation, the anticipation, I can kind of feel that maybe not wanting to get too involved, you're being very much fly on the wall here. But for the after, you've got two at least two of your performers looking straight down the barrel at you and kind of sharing their inner state and their reflections after their performance. How is that?
Drew Forsyth 28:50
I mean, first of all, I mean it's such a privilege to be in these spaces with these people. And yeah, I deliberately didn't want to show the thing that they do because you know, you know what they do. You this these professions are so familiar to us that we we all you know that, but when they step off stage, and I I mean that in a kind of general sense, yeah, even though literally Bethany is stepping off stage.
David McClelland 29:15
And Max was in a theatre for his work as well, you could argue.
Drew Forsyth 29:19
In the theatre, that's right. Um so I just wanted to I wanted to see them. Do you know what I mean? I think once they step off stage, there is like a moment where they're readjusting back to reality, and if and I tried to catch them before that happens and before they, you know, maybe put the walls back up or put the mask back on or become more kind kind of quote unquote professional. I wanted to see I wanted to see that kind of vulnerability and and that kind of you know emotional intimacy. Because it, I mean, it is so draining. This is the thing that they have dedicated their whole lives to, and it takes it out of them. It's a physical act, and so I think I really wanted to see some of that.
David McClelland 30:05
So reflecting that back on on your work, and I'll I'll continue with with some more of your of your projects in a moment, but on your approach to work, you you've said how you're quite how you were very drawn to these professionals who are so focused uh at that point of doing what they do. Is that is there something inside you that that looks up to that, that that relates that? Would you describe Drew as a high performer? Or uh is it something that you're searching from from these high performers?
Drew Forsyth 30:35
It's something I definitely strive for. And I do I do push myself really hard, and I do try to work as hard as I can. And in order to achieve all the things that I want to achieve, I would, you know, ask any one of my ex-partners if they would describe me as ambitious or ruthless. But um, yeah, I think there is definitely something that I'm searching for in me that's reflected back in the images, and I think, you know, all the is and especially you know something that I'm really attracted to, not just in my work but in my personal life, is that strength and that kind of I don't know, this the the that power. There's something that's very attractive about that, and it just so happens that I can translate it into my into my work. But yeah, I I don't know. I I think there's something very mesmerizing about about these people who uh who really are just so good at at what they do. I don't know. It's amazing.
David McClelland 31:36
Sometimes you don't need to know there's there's a feeling, even if it's difficult to put your finger on it, you know, that some magic or whatever it is is that is happening. Yeah, yeah. Uh what's your background, Drew? How did you come into the photography space?
Drew Forsyth 31:52
So photography was just a hobby for me for years. You know, I I uh when I was a when I was a teenager, I started uh, you know, my first serious girlfriend was very very into photography, and and you know, as part of the the wooing process, she said, Are you into photography? And I just said uh, oh yeah, of course. Oh yeah. Having never having never yeah, oh a hundred percent, oh definitely, yeah. And so, you know, that day I went out and bought a camera. And um and that was it, really. That was when I was about gosh, I must have been 17, 18. And yeah, as I say, it was a hobby for years. I don't really have any formal training in it, it just grew and grew, and over time you photograph your friends and then friends of friends, and then before you know it, people are messaging you and saying, Hi, how much do you charge? and there's no connection. And that was like the first moment where I thought, oh gosh, I this I might be onto something here when there were kind of no mutual people. Do you know what I mean?
David McClelland 32:51
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So uh uh and uh at what point did you I mean you mentioned portraits uh and finding the wow moment? At what point did you start to see that path really crystallize? This is what I'm gonna have a go at doing, and yeah, uh, and this is gonna be my focus for it. Did that kind of did that crystallize fairly early on for you what it is that you wanted to do, and you've been following that bone ever since, or is it kind of morphed over the 10, 15 or so years that you've been doing this?
Drew Forsyth 33:23
I think there was a crystallizing moment, which was my first photo shoot with a dancer, with a ballerina. And up until that point, I'd been just photographing anything and everything, people, interiors, jewellery, you know, everything. And then I did this photo shoot with this lady called Rachel, and she was amazing, ballerina. And I just and it was at that point where I thought, oh my god, there's something in this. Like I think it's this, like there's a physical feeling that I felt where I was like, Whoa, this is I've not experienced anything like this before. And then over time I started to shoot more and more dance, but then there wasn't it like like I said earlier, I wouldn't really categorize myself as a dance photographer, and for a while I was really that was tussling with that because I was like, God, I'm I love shooting dancers, but I'm not that into watching dance. Like, what is it? And it was only really during the the pandemic that I kind of properly sat down and thought, right, what what is going on here? Analysed it and and realized, okay, wow, what I'm really interested in is is strength, is power, is you know, uh prestige, is all of these things, and then that realization really helped channel and shape my entire career going forward from that.
David McClelland 34:39
Okay, okay. Going back in a way, not only to the performance, but also to the to the theatre, and you know, you've described the kind of theatricality, the the wow of your work. There's another one of the personal projects that I was drawn to, which is half-hour call. And for those in the theatre, they know that half-hour isn't 30 minutes, it's 35 minutes, but it is a very kind of privileged time. It is the getting ready, it is the moment before the thing happens. And there's a real body of work not only in the dance space and not only in, I guess, what you would traditionally call theatre, but of people who are about to go on stage and perform there. And I guess that's another point of the access that somehow you've you you've cultivated, you have developed, you've got your foot in the door there and been able to capture these very privileged moments.
Drew Forsyth 35:35
Yeah, I mean, it is an absolute privilege being trusted back there. That's the thing. I mean, the access, it takes for some of the people that I've got in the project, it takes years to get to that point. Because, you know, that time that you talk about that 35 minutes before the show goes up, is a very delicate uh time, and people approach that time in very different ways. There are some people who are absolutely bouncing off the walls, who are, you know, really excited to get out there, and that comes across in the images, and then there's some people who you can't even really look directly at them because they're freaking out so much, and that spans across like you know, whoever you might have in your head, it's not them. Do you know what I mean? Like, there are some people who are very outspoken and excited when they're on stage, but backstage, they're just like they're like ghosts. So when I'm shooting, you know, one of the things that I do try to do is I just mirror their energy so what or like reflect it back to them. So if they're very nervous and quiet and self-reflective, I try to be very quiet and sensitive. And if they're super excited, I try and match that energy as well. But yeah, it it's it is that thing. Like what when I'm pitching people to to do that and and kind of be with them, I really am talking to them about legacy, and I'm talking to them about these moments that really there is no one there for, especially for these individual performers. Like, it's just them backstage. You know, you know, you talk about these kind of shows that are like one man, one mic, you know what I mean? So stand-up comedians and that kind of thing. It's just them in that and they might be, you know, there's someone that I've I haven't put up there yet, but they were performing at co-op live here in Manchester. You know, there's 20,000 people out there, and it's just them in one dressing room. You know, the night before it was Drake and like his entourage. There's like 500 people back there, dancers and you know, all this stuff. But then with this performer, it was just this one, it was one bloke backstage, and that's yeah, but that's it. Like, so yeah, I do say to them, like, would you like this moment to be the you know, to be kind of uh it's that Jurassic Park thing, it's like a fly in the amber, right? Like, would you like that? Would you like this for your grandchildren? And then nine times out of ten they say yes.
David McClelland 37:52
There is a kind of tension or or at least the opposites there about and it's interesting that you mention it, about performers, particularly those one night stand comics often, it feels like a really, really sociable job when you're in an audience with 200, 2,000, 20,000 people and everyone's having a laugh with whoever it is on stage. But the reality is very, very different backstage travelling around. Maybe you've got a tour manager if you've reached a certain level, but but that's about it. And the reason that I find that interesting is because I wanted to ask you about that. As a photographer, often we look at your work and it's very easy to think about that as being quite a sociable job because often, particularly with portraits, it's you, it it's other people. But the reality isn't always that way. I mean, how do you find managing being a uh one-man band, uh do you make a conscious outreach to connect with other photographers? Or is this it do you feel that loneliness at all? What what what's your take on what can be a solitary profession?
Drew Forsyth 39:03
It can be incredibly lonely. That's one thing I would say. And if you're not careful and you don't cultivate relationships and you don't reach out to people, you like you can start to climb the wall. Because it really is just you. Like, especially with you know, some of these projects, the access kind of depends on it being just you. So no makeup artist, no assistant, no like no one. It is literally just you. I mean, some of the stuff that I shot out in the States, you know, these people are very suspicious of outsiders, so it really can be just you. And it I work really hard to make friends with, you know, my my amazing team, so makeup artists and assistants and you know, industry people. And I try really hard because if I don't, I know that I would slowly you start that slow descent into madness. And and you you can spiral, especially, especially if you get a bad one bad email, you can just completely spiral into insanity. And so I try really hard to make sure that I'm surrounded by people who get it, if you like, and who kind of are either in the industry or adjacent to the industry, and you know, and and and yeah, because because otherwise I'd go I'd go mad.
David McClelland 40:23
Yeah, yeah. And I think that's a really important point that it it sometimes does take effort to make those connections from outside. Super so um because sometimes it just does doesn't happen organically, and you can find yourself spiralling a great word, unfortunately, um, without necessarily realising it. So that little tap on the shoulder, that little email or something can be really important. Definitely. You mentioned New York there, and I think that brings me on to the next images that of yours that I want to take a look at, and it's kind of outside of the performance space in a way, at least outside of a theatre, um, and it's shot on film. And this is this is you with a holy grail camera, the uh Hasselblad X-Pan 2. So, yeah, for anyone who hasn't come across this, and I know a lot of our audience on the photography video show will have done, but for anyone who doesn't know what the X-Pan or the X Pan 2 is from Hasselblad, how do you describe it?
Drew Forsyth 41:24
The X-Pan 2 is like you're right, it's the jewel in the crown of rare, kind of impossible to find expensive cameras. So, of course, from a kind of technical, I'm sure the audience will be kind of pretty familiar with it, but from a technical perspective, it it is a panoramic 35mm camera, so it shoots two 35mm frames kind of side by side at the same time. One of the great things about it though is that you can switch it to a r regular 35 halfway through a roll, which again makes it even more unique. Um basically about uh what year is it? About three years ago, I went through an absolutely catastrophic world-ending breakup, and I thought, I'm I need something to cheer me up here. This camera has been on my list for basically as soon as I discovered photography, and I did have an opportunity to buy one in like 2012 or something like that, but I didn't I couldn't afford it, and then obviously they've gone off about a million percent since then. So I thought, you know, after my breakup, I thought, right, I'm gonna buy this camera, and I'm gonna whenever I go traveling, I'm gonna take this camera with me. I'm not gonna use my phone, I'm not gonna use any of the little digital cameras, I'm just gonna take the X-Pan, and it's been great. Hmm.
David McClelland 42:46
What's been great about I mean, in in terms of the images, um that it's hassle blad, of course, but what is it what's been great for you as a photographer when working with this? Because I'm guessing you don't work with film when you are on location in studio, typically, you're you're working digitally. So, what's different about working with a film camera and one that's forcing you to think in a much wider frame, perhaps?
Drew Forsyth 43:11
I think the thing that it really has forced me to do, and the kind of amazing thing about it actually has been that it's made me fall back in love with photography. You know, when I I shoot digitally and I shoot for clients, and you know, it's my job. And I think if you're not careful, it can really start to just feel like your job. You know what I mean? So when I bought the camera, I thought, oh, I'm gonna start shooting on film, which is something I'd never really done before. And so that was a whole new discovery. I thought, oh wow, this is amazing. And then forcing yourself to work with an aspect ratio that is just wildly impractical is has been amazing. And suddenly, like all it it really kind of resets your photography brain because you have to think, oh my goodness, how on earth am I gonna fit all of this in that tiny little letterbox? And then And do I want to do that? And yeah, yeah. And that's just been absolutely eye-opening. Like it I rediscovering my love of photography through that camera has just has been such a gift. And it was worth it was worth all that money.
David McClelland 44:15
Have you done any vertical panoramas with it as well?
Drew Forsyth 44:20
You know what? I just got back from a long weekend in Paris, and the I the Eiffel Tower, I think, really lends itself to the vertical uh so I shot a bit of that. And I had you know what I have bits and pieces, bits and pieces. I have. And when I was in New York, when I was in the I was in a dance studio photographing one of the dancers, I shot a fair few kind of of those vertical things. In fact, I mean I said to the guy, I was renting some gear over there, and one one of the guys in the rental house was like, So what are you shooting with your hassle plaid? And I said, I'm shooting some uh contemporary ballet. And he said, What? Okay, what do you what do you mean? Like so, yeah, having again, and yeah, like it forcing you to think differently has just been it's so magical. And also when you're out in the when you're out and about, people do stop you, which is nice. You're like a little kind of photography celebrity. People go, Oh my god, is that an X-Pan? And I go, That's this is an X-Pan too. And they go, Oh, I know.
David McClelland 45:21
It's a certain type of person that would be stopping you and asking that question. But if they're asking you that question, then you know that probably you'll be good to have a good conversation with them, let's face it.
Drew Forsyth 45:31
Yes, that's true. You do meet interesting people that way, that's for sure.
David McClelland 45:36
Let's switch back into some of the work that pays the bills, the the the commercial work that you do, uh, and maybe maybe some of the more recent work as well. And I know that uh with uh BBC and uh Expectation North. Um in fact I had iPlayer on only earlier today, and I saw Emergency 24-7 on the uh BBC iPlayer screen there with some key art provided by you. How how how's that stuff coming about? Because that feels in a way similar, but in a way quite different maybe to the personal projects. And I know that personal projects kind of complement or or balance the commercial work, but how's the how's the BBC stuff uh and the other key art stuff that you're doing commercially coming around and how are you enjoying it?
Drew Forsyth 46:20
Well, first of all, I love it because it is it's different, it's really different to kind of my normal campaign stuff. Like it, I don't, you know what? It's one of those things where like I just had a random email one day from a production company that I'd never heard of saying, Hi, can you come and take some onset stills for this TV show that we're filming? And I said, sure. And I got I got there and took the photos, and uh, you know, you get chatting to the what turned out to be the executive producer. I'm I had no idea, just seemed like a nice bloke called Colin. Uh, and you know, you get chatting, and then he he says, uh, oh, we're doing the poster next week. Why don't you come and shoot that? And you go, Okay, great. Oh wow. And so that was the first thing that I shot for them, which was a few years ago now, um, which was called Boot Dreams.
David McClelland 47:03
And um, yeah, Millie Bright was that was that one of the shoots with Millie Bright, uh England former lioness uh captain, I think she was fantastic.
Drew Forsyth 47:14
Yes, that's right. Yeah, photographed her and Anton Ferdinand and uh Roman Kemp and all these people, and it was it was fab. But then the yeah, obviously they're a massive production company, so they say, Can you come and do first murder 24-7 key art for that, and then emergency 24-7? And it, I mean, for me, it just plays into that thing that I mean it's the access. That's what I love. It's one of the things that runs through my work, is is that access? So photographing surgeons, photographing, you know, footballers at the height of their career. Talk, you know, when I photographed Millie, she had been, I think it was the previous weekend she'd been down to London to collect her, you know, MBE, or you know, they've been on that tour. And I said to her, like, you know, how do you remember everything that's happening to you right now? And she was like, I just take a lot of photos. And I was like, Yeah, yeah. So yeah. So I mean, yeah, and it's through through the television work I've I've been very fortunate to meet all these really interesting people, but yeah, it doesn't really matter for me, it doesn't matter what they do, as long as they're really good at it. So, like with the surgeons, so I was for the for the key art on the emergency 24-7 key art, you'll see there's a there's a surgeon there, and he's got these kind of special glasses, and I said, and he was a hand surgeon, and I said to him, Okay, and I love doing this. I just say I ask all the questions that I w wonder about, and I said, Okay, if you had to lose a finger, which finger would you want to lose? Because he's a hand surgeon, so he must know. And he said to me, It's the finger that you would least expect that I would not want to lose. So, like, it's your he said, I would want to keep I can I you've got to keep your pinky because about you know, and your 80% of your grip strength comes from your pinky.
David McClelland 49:03
Really?
Drew Forsyth 49:03
He said, If you if you have if you have to lose a finger, it's your pointing finger. You lose that one first because your next one kind of switches over in in your mind really quickly. So this is why I love working with these people because I get to ask them all these questions, you know. If I lose a finger, how long do I have left? Are you asking these questions in the middle of the shoot, or is it is this all at the preparation? No, no, no. I'm asking them when they're in front of me, I'm asking them because one, I might not get the opportunity to meet them again. But secondly, like I the the kind of the more serious like reason that I'm actually asking them that is because I'm you know, stepping into a photography like into the studio can be quite an intimidating thing, even for people who are very, very uh you know, very, very experienced. So I I really want to get them talking about what they know about and what their area of expertise is. And so if I can ask them something that they either haven't been asked before or is like a fun sideways kind of question, but is still within their area of expertise, then it really can relax them. And suddenly they're not thinking about all the lights and the assistant and the makeup artists and the onset masseuse, they're not thinking about any of that, they're thinking about their job, you know what I mean? So yeah, it does have there is like a kind of secret little motivation to ask more questions like that.
David McClelland 50:22
Of course, yes. I I like to find common ground where I can with somebody, and you know, that can create uh a dialogue, a conversation, like like as you say, it just enables all of the lights and whatever else is going on just to disappear for a few moments, but also I think creates potentially a connection between you and them that wouldn't be there otherwise. Um 100%. And then there's there's a piece of work that I I've seen you worked on. I I'd love to hear about it, where you were literally conducting the BBC Philharmonic Orchestra. Uh and I I don't know if you had a bat on or not in order to do that, but you had what dozens and dozens of professional musicians in a massive sound stage, massive studio, and trying to take what looked like a really, really ambitious portrait, I guess, of the ensemble. Tell us a bit more about that one, how that one came about, and what the challenge was on the day to try and orchestrate it.
Drew Forsyth 51:23
Very good. So I have this ongoing project called Principle, where I photographed principal ballerinas and ballet dancers, you know, around the world. And in 2022, I photographed a dancer called Nancy, and she's the principal dancer with uh the Dutch national ballet. Okay. And we photographed her here in Manchester, and it was in an abandoned warehouse because she is originally from Manchester. So I photographed her here. I was in a big abandoned warehouse with uh you know dust everywhere, and it was amazing. Anyway, about a year later, I had a random email from the head of production at the BBC Phil, and she said, We loved your pictures of Nancy in the warehouse. Can you come and photograph the orchestra? And I said, Uh, is this a scam? Is this a a joke? And uh we went for coffee and it was real. And basically, she came to me, she kind of came to me with a bit of a problem, and she said, Look, every picture of an orchestra that you see looks exactly the same, and that's them in a in a kind of half semicircle, they're all dressed in black and white in their tuxes, and uh you can't tell which orchestra is which. Can you come and do something interesting with us? And I said, I would love to. And so it started from there. I always start with these big projects, I always start with the creative first, and then I do the production because I always think I can have a I can tone down a mad creative idea, yeah, but I can't like pump up a boring production one. So I said to them, as part of the prep, I said, Can I come and watch them rehearse? And she said yes. And I went in, and as she as um the producer opened the door, the sound of the orchestra just hit me like a huge wave, and it was amazing, it was a fully physical uh feeling, and then from that point on I thought, Well, wouldn't it be great to represent these musicians as a wave?
David McClelland 53:25
You know what I mean?
Drew Forsyth 53:26
On you know, in the in the final image. And I pitched the idea to uh to the BBC and they said yes, and I thought, oh no. How am I gonna do this?
David McClelland 53:38
How do I do that?
Drew Forsyth 53:40
And and I said, uh, oh, um, and and then before I could say I don't know how to do it I'm sorry, but I don't know how to do that. Um that they said, well, we obviously work with staging companies all around the world to to you know put stages in unconventional spaces. We can sort that out for you. And I was like, great. So then we had a we had a stage uh built and it was uh yeah, around 80 musicians, and yeah, it took so on the afternoon we were in there all morning kind of setting everything and making sure that everything was kind of ready to go. Then when the orchestra came in, it's just like it's like a school football team, you know, you're picking them one or two at a time, and they're all grumbling, and but you know, you're doing it. It took about 45 minutes to an hour to place everyone on the stage. Okay.
David McClelland 54:29
Um, and then and you knew where each of these people, the the these groups of people would be going. You'd already plotted that.
Drew Forsyth 54:37
Yes, so I had um as part of the preparation, um, I came across a photographer called Art Striber, who I'd highly recommend your audience, and well, maybe your audience would be familiar with his work, but he'd done a portrait of uh for the Paramount Studios 100-year anniversary, uh, he'd taken a portrait of all of these actors on stage, and I thought, wow, I should, I should, you know, I'd love to do something like that. And part of his prep was, you know, you have the map, which was which in my case was an iPad with 82 red dots on it from a top-down view and then a front arm view, so I could figure it out. And really, once you if you take a long time to look at that photo, really it's not like one group, it's there's a group of five over here, there's three over here, there's four here, there's seven across there, and they're all these little clumps, and they all interact with each other to create this huge uh to kind of break up the the image. So yeah, like when it when it came time to take the photo, it we took it in just in one, you know, with six lights either, sorry, three look three huge lights either side.
David McClelland 55:38
He must have been big lights to light all of those uh 80 or so people, goodness me.
Drew Forsyth 55:43
Oh my god, yeah. So that we had we had six Pro Photo D2s, I think. So they're a thousand watt heads, you know, pretty much at full power.
David McClelland 55:51
Yeah.
Drew Forsyth 55:52
Bang. Um, so I was up the ladder and I had the uh the the loud haler, and you know, you are saying to them, I you know, it's hard holding the attention of the of of everyone for that period of time is really, really hard. So I did say to them, I took one and then I looked at the laptop and I just said, Okay, everyone, let's take one that we can actually use. And then they all kind of and some of them laughed and some of them didn't, and some of them whatever, and then we took that one and then they all kind of relaxed a little bit. Um so we shot all that and it was great, and the client's really happy. And then I said, Okay, I want to I think it's good, but I think we can make it better, but it is a bit of a risk. And the client that they, you know, BBC, they were already the whole team were there, they were really happy with the images we shot so far. So I said, Okay, let me just try this, and if it doesn't work, we can just throw away. And what I did, I'd seen um, I think Annie Liebewitz do a similar thing where she had like a an assistant with the light on a stick and then gone through this group photo and lit part parts of it kind of individually.
David McClelland 57:03
Oh, right.
Drew Forsyth 57:03
Yeah, and then stitched it all together in Photoshop after the fact. And I'd never done that before, I'd only seen it on a YouTube video. And I thought oh, we can uh we'll give this a go. How hard can't we? There's no taxis outside yet, we've got a little bit of time. Exactly. So we did that and it ended up being about 15, 20 images, and then stitched it all together in Photoshop, and then that was it. That was the one they ended up using, and the light was the one softer. Yeah, yeah. And we it was just because it was just a risk. Because we'd been so efficient and meticulous in the planning. We had 10 minutes at the end. So oh, what do we do? Let's let's do a fun one. And that was and that was it.
David McClelland 57:42
It's often those fun ones. Now we've got one in the can that the client's happy with, I'm happy with, we've got a bit of playtime here, and you know this, and yeah, and you've heard these stories as as often as I have. It's often those, what should we do in the last 10 minutes while we've still got the space and still got the talent or still got what they're the ones where the guard's down a little bit, and you can be that little bit more creative, and so often they end up being the ones that end up making the cut, which is great. Which is great. And and also it instructive. And uh the thing that I take, one of the things that I take from that story, all the way back at the beginning, was your first experience and that moment of inspiration. Uh and I think it's so instructive about opening the door and feeling that sound, f seeing almost that sound wave hit you in a moment of synesthesia. Because I think it's very easy to go into an environment, to a to a meeting, a creative meeting, almost with an idea already there, and to ignore those initial stimuli. But actually, those first instincts, those first feelings that we get when we meet somebody, when we step into a space or whatever it is, they're so important. And I think actually it's so easy to shut those out. But the right thing to do is to go in on receive rather than go in on transmit and make a note of those and respond to them. And that's where your sound wave, I guess, concept for this comes from, which is which is great to hear.
Drew Forsyth 59:06
Definitely.
David McClelland 59:07
Drew, w we're almost out of time for now, uh unfortunately. But question I do want to ask is as we're recording today, sort of on the home straight for 2026, sort of last quarter-ish happening. Um what's on your wish list for 2027? We've spoken about the the focus that you would mire in those who, you know, it's so certainly in some of the professional projects and personal projects that you've worked you've worked on there. Are you someone who sets targets? Do you have like a target volume of work or a target set of clients or a target I'd like to be doing more of this in 2027? Do you sit down and kind of like do a bit of a planning session for the next period, whether it's a year or not, or is it more organic than that for you?
Drew Forsyth 59:54
It is definitely planned. I am, you know, and I take the same approach to my holidays. I am not a fun guy to be on holiday with because we've got to stick to the spreadsheet. Um so when I think about 20, so I I do that, I do do this. I I have all my goals at the beginning of the year, and in fact, I have them uh I I won't uh show you, but I do have them for 2026 written right here. So, like I and some of them I've done. So I have that, and then I sit down once a quarter and I do the same thing. I go, where are we up to? For next year, we're not quite at the planning stages yet, but I think definitely more hybrid shooting, so shooting more video alongside or more motion alongside stills. I love doing that. Started working with an amazing DOP and having someone bring my someone else bring my stuff to life is just like absolutely amazing. So I love that. I I I think I would really like to work with more gold medal-winning Olympic athletes. I already have any of them in my portfolio, and I think you know, I'm very close to the uh to the velodrome here in Manchester, and I just think there must be something, and you know, so I'm putting that out into the into the universe. So a bit of bit of motion and uh some more uh gold medal athletes.
David McClelland 1:01:13
Well, I'm I'm happy to play a small part in hopefully manifesting some of those 2027 targets. Uh Drew, it has been fantastic to speak with you today. We'll put links and all of the stuff that that we normally do in the show notes here. But uh for now, I hope to bump into you in Manchester, in the West End, somewhere else, or maybe in a Vela Dream uh before too long. But for now, Drew, thanks for joining us on the Photography and Video Show podcast.
Drew Forsyth 1:01:40
Thank you so much for having me.
David McClelland 1:01:45
Big thanks again to Drew. Links to his work in the show notes.
London event updates
David McClelland 1:01:49
Time now to share some exciting updates on the in-person photography and video show taking place in London from the 13th to the 16th of March 2027. In this month's What Three Things? Three more exciting things to know ahead of the London show in March. The show is a great place to try kit and get face-to-face expert advice. And with that in mind, there is a veritable shopping arcade of brands and exhibitors who are already confirmed to be at the 2027 show with their latest wares and helpful experts on hand. New and familiar brands including Canon, OM System, NANLIT, Rico, Manfrotto, Rhodes, Sigma, Tamron, Hanna Muller, Pro Photo, Intrepid Camera, Style Digital, Pink Design, and many, many more, all confirmed with new exhibitors being added every week. Another great thing about the show is that once you've tried Dream Kit the size, you have the opportunity to buy it too from the dedicated retailers on the show floor, often with some incredible, never-to-be repeated show deals. So you can try, buy, and take home your dream camera or your next essential investment all on the same day. In the lead up to London, the photography and video show presents is a series of exclusive pre-show events, workshops, and gatherings in London to celebrate the city's creative vibe. They'll be taking place between October and March. Keep your eyes and ears peeled right here for more details. And that is
See you in October!
David McClelland 1:03:33
all we have time for this month's big thanks to all of our guests and big thanks to you for sticking it out all the way through to the end. We'll be back at the beginning of October with more camera news, reviews, and features, as well as more exciting updates on the in person show. But until then, from all of the team here, bye bye.
About Drew Forsyth
Drew Forsyth is a Manchester-based commercial and portrait photographer specialising in arts, culture, and performance. He works with leading organisations including English National Ballet, the Hallé Orchestra, BBC Philharmonic, Phoenix Dance Theatre, and the Science & Industry Museum, as well as advertising and creative agencies across the UK and internationally.
Drew is accredited by the Association of Photographers (AOP) and is a Fellow of the Royal Society of Arts (RSA). He has photographed principal dancers from the Royal Ballet, English National Ballet, and Alvin Ailey American Dance Theater, and his work has been published by the BBC, The Guardian, The Times, and Rolling Stone.
His long-term personal project, Principal, documents principal dancers from dance companies around the world. His series Power and Principal, shot with ballerina Bethany Kingsley-Garner, captures the athletic strength and physical discipline of professional ballet. He also shoots on analogue film using a Hasselblad XPan II panoramic camera.
Drew is available for editorial portrait commissions, campaign photography, and performing arts assignments throughout Manchester, the North West, and the UK. He can be contacted at drew@drewforsyth.com or +44 7791 425 591.
